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PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

What it feels like to send your first born off to college

08/22/2019

I will not name names. But this was a Facebook post written by a dad I know who drove his oldest child–his son, who happens to be my grandson–to college a few days ago and managed to keep those lump-in-throat emotions in check–for a while:

And for those who are asking the obvious question, by some miracle I did not cry. (No one will believe that.)

At least not until I got home and found a letter from him on the kitchen table. Then it was full-on runny nose blubbering.

He will be so happy there and I will still miss him so much.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

On-The-Job Advice: Helicopter parenting and your adult child’s work place.

08/12/2019

photo: Maia Lemov

Once our kids graduate–be it from college, graduate school or a specialized program–we're pleased when they land their first "career" job. They're launched. It's more than pleasing. It's thrilling.

But some of us have a hard time letting go and recognizing they are now on their own as professionals. I've written about parents who contacted their child's boss when they didn't like the way the company was treating their child. I think we can all agree that is a major overstep. I've taken note of other over-steps in the job search and work place here and here

How about this one? A parent wrote to the New York Times' Work Friend columnist, Megan Greenwell, that her daughter asked her for advice on a workplace issue and now she was asking the columnist to weigh in.

My 24-year-old daughter works for a small nonprofit. She has recently started to see a therapist one day a week, so she arrives an hour later than normal and stays an extra hour that day. She puts her arrival time into the organization’s calendar, which is the protocol if you have a doctor’s appointment, but since this is a weekly appointment, she wasn’t sure if she needs to explain where she is to the executive director. My initial response is that her therapy appointments are none of the director’s business, but now I wonder if I am just being old-fashioned. What do you recommend for her?

Megan Greenwell wasn't treating this as a "tell" or "not-tell" issue. She took it as a deeper incursion into the daughter's independence and autonomy. Here, in part, is what she wrote the mother about her daughter:

I’d recommend that she draw sharper boundaries with her mom. Asking family members for advice is entirely reasonable, but your outsourcing the question crosses the line into helicopter parenting. A 24-year-old is more than capable of navigating her own office politics.

"Over-parenting" can be a fine line. Is asking advice about the advice to give an adult child who has asked for advice crossing into the dreaded territory of helicopter parenting? Does it suggest we're making too much of the issue, of over-reacting to our adult child's situation?

Got an opinion on this? Please share.

(P.S. Here's how Greenwell came down on the actual issue of whether or not to tell:)

It sounds as though her boss has already agreed to her schedule change one day a week, so I don’t see a need for any further discussion about why. If arriving an hour late isn’t causing any problems, she can just keep filling out the calendar. She absolutely shouldn’t feel any shame for going to therapy — everyone should try it! — but she doesn’t need to go out of her way to make sure everyone knows, either.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Vacations and Adult Kids: Outgrowing a family tradition

07/22/2019

We are not vacationing with our grown children this year. Lots of people don't ever do it, but we did. We stayed in rustic condos in a resort in Vermont. We hiked mountain trails, we biked protected pathways and we splashed in mountain creeks. We taught our grandkids to skim rocks and to play tennis; they taught us Uno and the joy of an after-dark swim.

Paterfamilias and I are sad to see it come to an end. Was it something we said? No. It's that our grandkids are now teenagers with busy, complicated lives–and friends. They still love their PenPen and BaPa (that's me and Paterfamilias), but now they like to have a friend come along–someone who can mountain bike with them and dive off rocks or go for a run in the valley. Our oldest grandchild is getting ready to go to college in the fall and he has a summer job–which makes scheduling time in Vermont as a three-generation family daunting–even more so than factoring in our grown children's work schedules and business travel demands.

Time moves on. We're going to Vermont for a week anyway–without the kids or grandkids. We love the rugged mountains, the crisp air, the ease that comes with not having to lock your door. You can play tennis at noon in Vermont and not die of the heat. We'll take some hikes–not as challenging as the ones we did with them but we'll still be walking along leafed-in paths that inevitably climb to yet another, sigh, waterfall. We'll enjoy it. But it won't be the same. The heart of the vacation will be missing. Just another of those adjustments we make as parents of grown children and grandparents of their almost-grown children.

Change stirs things up; it adds excitement to life, right? I'll know more about that when we get back from our vacation for two in Vermont.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Money Matters: The Wisdom of the Crowd on loan versus a gift to adult children

07/10/2019

Okay. So crowdsourcing wisdom is just another way of saying Reader Comments on an issue that cuts close to many of our hearts and pocketbooks. Often, though, those comments are more than passing remarks. They carry kernals of wisdom based on years of experience. So here is commentary from my readers responding to Michele Singletary's advice on when to cut the financial aid to adult children and from those who responded to a New York Times article calling for tips on managing household finances–with loans/gifts to family members eliciting commentary from two readers.

First up: General advice from a New York Times reader on financial assists, whether it's your kin or someone else in need:

“If you do give money to someone, you have no right to dictate what they do with it….This principle works for all kinds of donations. If I decide to give money to a family member, a person experiencing homelessness, or an institution, I have decided to trust their judgment, and I never think about it again.”

From a Parenting Grown Children reader responding to Michele Singletary's comment that, if you give to an adult child, the giving should help push that child toward financial independence:

"I like the quote from Singletary. Every child and every situation is different. We can cut those cords but sometimes we need to tape them back together for a short while in order to keep our children making forward progress."

While this reader doesn't address lending money to adult children per se, her comments could apply across the board. She wrote to the New York Times to say that when she was 10 years old, she lent a nickel to a classmate in Sunday school, and never got it back.

“I decided that I would never loan money to anyone again. I’m nearly 65 and I’ve kept my vow. I only give money away. I let people know it’s a gift and nothing is owed, in any manner. And I do it with a smile and graciously.”
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Observations: Michelle Singletary on when to cut an adult child’s financial cord

07/01/2019

I am not the only one writing about the helping hand versus tough love. Or how to find, as Michelle Singletary puts it in her Washington Post column, The Color of Money, "the balance between protecting our children and letting them learn the hard way."

She does not–as I do not–have an all-purpose, one-answer-fits-all solution. It depends. She writes about hearing from readers who are helping pay down their children's student loan debt and opening savings accounts for grandchildren ("We do not see this as an umbilical cord, we see it as an investment in their future.") and another reader who is supporting a child while he gets his PhD ("He'll get the money sooner or later, and he might as well get it when it will help the most.")

To be sure, it is not all "thanks and I'll pay you back on your investment in me." There are times when we might not hand over assets. Some kids exude an unpleasant air of entitlement, which could be a signal to tighten the fist. And, of course, not all of us can afford to be as generous to our kids as we would like to be.

Affordability aside, here's where Singletary comes down on the financial aid question:

Wherever you draw the line, take a step back and make sure you’re pushing your children toward being as self-supporting as possible.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Vacation Togetherness Addendum: More tips on the art of inclusion and compromise

06/21/2019

photo: Maia Lemov

Adventure travel with adult children is, well, an adventure with an extra dimension. "Though it gets less attention that traveling with young children, there are," a travel editor assures us, "as many joys and as many complications in traveling with adult offspring."

The editor's family–mother, father, two 20-something daughters–went to China and toured around remote Yunnan Province. The family "had to catch seven flights, spend a night together in a tiny sleeper train compartment, find restaurants to please every palate, and survive two illnesses, a mountainside van breakdown, altitude sickness, a shakedown and a couple of questionable hotels." That said, it was a wonderful and bonding experience. Looking back at it and other trips, the author, Elizabeth Chang, shares guidelines for travel with adult offspring. You can catch the full list here.

Here are a few highlights:

Consult everyone about the itinerary. Compromises need to be made but everyone should have a destination or site they're excited about.

Don't overbook–allow time for impulse visits and to recoup energy.

Create a shared document where everyone can check the hotels, departure and arrival times, names of guides hired.

Get separate rooms–everyone needs a chance to get away from each other.

Discuss money beforehand–as in, who's paying for what.

Have them organize and lead some of the trip excursions.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

My Tiny Love Story to my children and grandchildren

06/04/2019

It's my Tiny Love Story online in the New York Times.

With my littlest grandchild.

Noise, then Silence

My husband and I watched from the driveway as our son and his family of five packed their van for the 7-hour drive home. For a week, our house had thrilled to the sounds of small feet on stairs, stories being read, spoons clinking against cereal bowls. Now my littlest grandchild’s tricycle was put into the van’s hatch, the door slammed, the engine started. We leaned in for last hugs. As their car backed away, the sense of loss was sudden and sharp. For days we had been absorbed into the life of this precious family. And now, not. — Penelope Lemov
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Family Visits: Saying Goodbye Is the Hardest Part

05/29/2019

A friend recently returned from Denmark where she spent 10 days with her daughter and granddaughter who've lived outside Copenhagen for nearly 17 years. It was a pleasant visit, she reports. She saw her granddaughter act in a play, and the three of them went to Amsterdam for a look at the tulips. She and her daughter got along better than they usually do–they see each other two or three times a year–and she felt a special closeness to her teenage granddaughter.

My friend is not the sentimental type. That's why it surprised her when she started weeping when it came time to say goodbye. "I had such an empty feeling," she says.

I know. When my daughter lived on the West coast–in the other Washington–I used to sob in the back of the taxi as the driver raced me to the airport and my flight back east. My daughter and my baby granddaughter were thriving, so why was I blubbering? Empty feeling? Yes. Plus a regret that she lived so far away and I couldn't be there if she needed my help.

It's not just a female thing. The other day Paterfamilias had a farewell "moment" (non-blubber style) when his teenage granddaughter left for the airport after a three-day visit. Then there's this full-on emotional response a Canadian father wrote about his son's departure after a week-long visit.

His winter-battered car with ruby tail lights goes down to the end of the block to a cul-de-sac, swings around and comes back toward me. As he goes by, I slowly turn to wave at this one-man parade. I am silently saying goodbye. See ya’ soon. Safe journeys. The street light overhead fortunately doesn’t reveal the tears in my eyes, nor can it possibly reveal the less-tangible gap where loneliness is now in permanent residence.

…. I glance up and down the city block on which I have lived for more than 30 years. I have no idea why it seems so empty. Winter has turned the trickle of tears on my cheeks to a tiny frozen stream.

Is this the other side of the mansplaining coin? I tear-up every time I read it. All of us who have children who live far from us miss the daily or weekly get-together with our children and their children–be it tea, lunch or Sunday dinner. Or just a drop-by. Skype is nice but it's not the same.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Vacation Togetherness: Six tips on taking the grown kids (and maybe their kids) along

05/29/2019

When I was young and in my 20s–single and starting my career, then married and starting a family–I did not want to vacation with my parents. I'd been there, done that growing up. Now I wanted to taste adventure–not the same-old same-old with the same-old same-olds. Nor was I any different from my friends. We were all about striking out on our own.

How the worm has turned. Family Vacations Are Us. Not just us, as in my family. Cruise ships tout inter-generational groupings, so does VRBO and AirBnb, to say nothing of resorts and travel companies. (Even Roads Scholars, which caters to the 55+ set, has grandparent-grandchild outings.).

There are reasons for the trend. A major one: our grown kids may not live near us or each other, so a family get together is more reunion than vacation. Moreover, we're the generation that's had a soft landing. Many of us have retired or are near retirement with healthy retirement savings. Not only can we afford to travel, we can afford to invite our kids along.

Now that I'm the "same old same old" that my parents were when I broke away, I have embraced family togetherness. For the past 15 years Paterfamilias and I have rented condos in a resort in Vermont and invited our grown children and their families to join us. When we started it was because my daughter lived in Seattle and my son in Boston. They were both on the very beginning rungs of their careers–in graduate school or in first jobs. We wanted the reunion; we picked up the tab. But .as the years have skampered by and our kids have come into their primes, costs are shared. We're no longer the sole source of the rent, food and transportation–nor even the key decision maker about when the family vacay will take place. It's a complicated dance of work schedules and activities–theirs, not ours.

I've written several posts on tips for making these inter-generational get-togethers a satisfying vacation. [Here here and here.] but there is always room for another perspective. A British writer pulled together some guidance for Brits planning vacations with their grown children. Here are some of the pointers worth repeating. I'm particularly fond of the last one.

Make sure everyone has a say in the destination and activities. Consider renting two cars so you're not stuck all doing the same thing.

If the grown children work, they should contribute financially to the trip. If you're self-catering, everyone pitches in on meals–refuse to play 'mum' while on holiday.

Everyone gets a turn to be 'tour guide' for a day and decide on activities.

Young adults know the internet inside out – let them find out information and ease off the pedal. Your goal is to spend family time together – do you really care where and how?

Not everyone has to stay the entire time, especially if they're converging from different places.

If you are involving partners (or kids) of your adult children, the dynamic of intergenerational holidays may need to be discussed or you'll end up babysitting while they're escaping for fun.

Avoid the impulse to act like parents. Remember what it was like when you travelled in your 20s – most kids are smart and savvy to a far greater degree.
PARENTING GROWN CHILDREN: The children may be grown but we still have our issues.

Observations: Social Qs on correcting our adult children’s behavior

05/03/2019

So many things to love about our grown children. And yet, a few that irk, irritate or strike us as wrong. If they were eight years old, we would correct their behavior–point out the folly of their way, set them on a wiser path. But they're independent adults now and may even be parents themselves. What do we do when we see them do something that we feel needs correcting?

"Let it go" is the core of the advice from Philip Galanes (Social Qs) to a 62-year-old grandmother. She writes to say she finds it disturbing the way her 5-year-old grandson, whom she babysits twice a week, is subjected to the sight of her daughter and son-in-law kissing passionately in front him (and her). More specifically, here's what Galanes has to say (including an implied warning) about the "correction" issue:

A "big advantage your grandson currently enjoys is having a loving grandmother built into his weekly routine. Do your best to safeguard that — which means holding back, when possible, from criticizing the way your daughter and son-in-law run their household. As a parent of adult children, it often pays to be quiet about the ways their choices differ from yours."

Noise, then Silence